For our first Pod-Folio of 2025, we catch up with award-winning journalist, Gary Younge, and communications guru, Carys Afoko hosts of the podcast Over The Top Under The Radar. Gary and Carys started the podcast in 2024 as they were tired of poorly researched news stories that are over-reported and go way over the top. But on the other hand, they wanted show some love to let those important new stories that slip under the radar get their well-deserved. Each week they take a critical look at the news stories in the UK and further afield, it can be anything from Voter ID to Cowboy Carter, Welsh Steel and Garfield the Cat! But one thing is for sure is to expect scrutiny, real talk, and the odd special guest joining the conversation.

What inspired you to spotlight "over-reported" vs. "under-reported" stories in today’s news landscape?

Gary: As a self taught artist I learnt about art from books, artist biographies, visiting galleries and by listening to artist interviews on the radio. The audio interviews especially, inspired me hugely. I knew that there was a lack of Black and global majority artists and cultural workers represented in the media. Through Shade Podcast I created a space for us all to talk about our work in our own way.

Carys: The concept for the podcast comes from a shared belief in the power of journalism and a frustration at a lot of mainstream media reporting. The format allows us to unpack what isn't working and take a constructive approach.

We have both worked in newsrooms and have seen first hand how the decisions are made about which stories to cover (and therefore which stories not to cover) and then the decisions about how much time and space even the chosen stories get. Across the media we know there are very few people with our backgrounds or politics making those decisions, and we believe that's reflected in the stories that are served up to audiences and the way those stories are presented. By using the simple ‘over/under’ paradigm we got a format to structure our conversations that also allowed us to talk about the news values that led to those outcomes.

How do you both decide which stories make it to each episode?

Gary: I’m looking for issues that I care about where I/we might have an angle which would be fresh and interesting.

Carys: I try to pick stories I care about and things I think we can have a good conversation on. It's fun to have at least one topic we don't agree on although it doesn't happen every week.

We only know what each other wants to talk about because we have to put the subject in a WhatsApp group to get the research done. But that’s it in terms of structuring our discussions. So we don’t discuss the subjects before we record, nor do we discuss what angle each of us is going to take. We believe that’s how we have avoided stilting the natural conversations we are trying to capture.

How has your experiences in journalism and communications shaped your approach to the podcast?

Gary: In every way possible. I was a journalist for 26 years. have covered stories where I think the media went over the top in a range of ways and I have struggled to get articles printed that I thought were underreported. If you’re a leftwing journalist in the mainstream media then the mainstream news agenda is a constant challenge.

Carys: Working in PR for 15+ years means I know how stories are pitched and placed, why politicians and spokespeople speak in certain ways.

How do you see the role of podcasts evolving in today’s media ecosystem?

Gary: I wish I knew, Podcasts are clearly a growing part of the evolving media landscape. The lower technical and financial barriers to entry make it possible for a broader range of voices to be heard than in so called mainstream media. The flip side of that is there’s a lot of podcasts out there and there’s nothing like a TV programme guide to help you find them, and nothing like the TV review system in newspapers and magazines to help you find the good stuff.

Carys: The format of a good podcast conversation is completely different to the short and snappy style of a radio or TV interview. I think it makes for richer and more engaging conversations that feel more human.

What do you hope listeners take away from each episode?

Gary: I hope they learn something they didn’t know, particularly from the stories that are under the radar. I hope they see some of their views reflected and others challenged. I hope they have a laugh. But ultimately I hope we are helping to model/amplify a kind of healthy, humorous, critical, progressive conversation that lots of people are having but we very rarely see showcased.

Carys: We hope listeners feel that they’ve been eavesdropping on an informed conversation between two good friends, funny and serious in equal measure. We are both unashamedly of the left, and we hope we provide a counterweight, however small, to the general right-wing bias in UK media when it comes to deciding what things are worthy of discussion and the prism of possibilities through which issues are discussed. We also hope people recognise that whilst being black (and mixed race) sometimes gives us a different perspective on an issue or story, our racial background is just one of the many identities that informs the views that we have.

Where do you see Over The Top, Under The Radar heading in the next few years? And how can listeners support the podcast?

Gary: Well the financing is precarious so I don’t know that we’ll be around in the next few years. To that end listeners can support it by telling people about it and donating to our Patreon. It’s really that basic. In the absence of funding we can’t exist.

Carys: It’s clear to us that there’s a body of listeners - unapologetically left of centre, progressive, young (and young at heart), activist and engaged- that have been under-served and seeking a home. Many have found a home in Over The Top, Under The Radar, propelling us into the top 5% of podcasts in terms of downloads. We are now building a really active community around the podcast, with listeners across the UK and in Australia, Germany, Norway, USA and the Caribbean. Making podcasts may be relatively cheap but even if the hosts and principal backers are able to work for free there are still some staff and other costs that need to be paid for. We have eschewed traditional advertising, because the platform algorithms that select the adverts pay little or no heed to our values and the values of our listeners. Instead we have asked our listeners to support us financially, via Patreon, and to date nearly 350 are doing that and are now covering about 25% of the costs. We believe with this continuing and growing support, and with backing from some well chosen sponsors, along with more live events (including Scotland) and possibly some limited merchandise we can be fully sustainable in 2025.

Thanks again to Gary and Carys for taking part in Pod-Folio. You can discover more about Over The Top Under The Radar HERE